Was That Just His Grief Talking?
What happens when a man experiences an intense loss…and then behaves very, very erratically? Well, a reader named Heather knows all about it, and she’s got some questions. When they split up, he said some pretty tough stuff. Was it the grief talking, or did he mean it?
Hi, love this place…so many answers to life’s puzzling questions! So I met someone online in Sept. When we first started emailing he told me his mother had been diagnosed with terminal cancer but believed she would live.
Wow. Holy cow. See, already I can tell you that this is going to be a very complex time to date most men. Most guys, when they’re feeling very vulnerable, tend to behave a little strangely. As I’m sure you’re about to tell me…
We had our first date on Halloween and for the next four weeks things were great (as the relationship goes anyway) his mother’s health was fading fast but he maintained his belief that she would get better and on more than one occasion stated, “I have to get her better”.
Oh man, that poor guy for thinking that. I mean, it’s hard enough to have a loved one dying, but to think that it’s up to you to get her better? Unless he’s moonlighting as House M.D., he’s in for quite a shock. (And if he IS House M.D., by any chance, he’s probably not a great guy in relationships anyway, if the TEEvee has told me the truth. And when has it not?)
During that first month we saw each other once a week and spoke by phone or communicated by text everyday. At one point he even came out, in the pouring rain, to meet my friends. He did this after I didn’t know my cell was ringing and he took a chance that we were still there. I met his brother and his best friends. We would talk on the phone for hours (sometimes three) and talk about everything. We really seemed to be hitting it off.
The Tuesday after Thanksgiving his mother died. Everything went downhill from there. I saw him only one time in Dec. though we still spoke on the phone and communicated via text.
Seems like that makes sense. Holidays, death in the family, total mayhem. Hard to find time for anything.
When we spoke he would talk about the things we could do, the movies we could see, places we could go, he wanted me to teach him to ski. He talked about how I was pretty, successful, intelligent and how talking with me helped. He talked about his mom and since I had lost my father as a child we discussed the shared pain of not having one of our parents.
Sounds like he was really allowing you to help him ease back into, you know, the real universe. I’m guessing there’s a twist a-coming?
Then, just before Christmas he broke up with me, stated he couldn’t start a new relationship now. I listened and though we texted a few times we didn’t see each other.
Aaaaand there it is. Ouch.
After New Years he called me and talked about how he was doing much better and wanted to see me. Stated he’d missed me. We saw each other the next night and it was wonderful.
Sounds…good….
We saw each other one other time after that and then nothing for two weeks. I got one response to a text I sent and then he went silent.
And there’s that other shoe. Double ouch.
We ended up breaking up over email with me leading the break up. I felt horrible but couldn’t take not knowing. He ended it with telling me he was not emotional about anything and that he hadn’t liked anyone since his last girlfriend. You could have knocked me over with a feather. I really thought he liked me but to see those words was very painful. Was this grief talking or lack of interest or both? Any thoughts would be appreciated!
Heather
Dear Heather,
First of all, I’m sorry you had to go through all of that with this guy. At any given time absolutely everybody’s got SOME weird emotional issues tugging at them from some direction, but it looks like you hit this guy right in the middle of Hurricane Mom Passed On. And that’s why you got the herky-jerky, now you see him now you don’t routine. So, your question:
WAS IT GRIEF, OR LACK OF INTEREST, OR BOTH?
I’m going to say that it was a third thing — total confusion based on emotional upheaval.
This guy thought he could “get” his mom better. Ok, that right there is what we in the manslations business call “BS” or “giving yourself an unnecessarily hard time.” So basically, he’s saying that his mother’s very survival was in his hands. You said in the very first paragraph that she had been diagnosed with “terminal” cancer but he “thought she would live.” Uh…look, that word “terminal”? I know doctors don’t know everything, and are sometimes wrong. (House M.D. calls most of them “idiots” on a regular basis.) But I’m pretty sure they don’t just throw that word around. I’m pretty sure they use that word when they’re trying to let you get used to the idea that the time is coming.
So right there, you’ve got a guy in pretty serious denial. And understandably so — it happens all the time in super stressful situations. Like, for example, if someone theoretically, hypothetically had a family member with terminal cancer.
AND THEN…
Of course, as it happens, denial doesn’t actually stop reality from happening. When she died, he:
- Maintained contact, but couldn’t quite get out the door to see you.
- Then, right around the holiday, he breaks it off.
- Then, a little while later, he wants to get together.
- Then, an even littler while later, you break up for good because he “wasn’t emotional about anything” and blah, blah, blah, not since the ex-girlfriend.
WHEN CONTROL FREAKS COLLIDE WITH, YOU KNOW, THE EARTH
I think what you saw there was some major, major pendulum action brought on by his realization that he ain’t controlling squat. He couldn’t keep his mom from dying. He liked being with you, but was feeling totally vulnerable and,um… (out of control) what’s the term…(out of control)…it’s a feeling of…oh, I don’t know (out of control)…something…oh, I’m sure it will come to me.
So in an effort to regain control, he breaks it off. Out of control situation — CONTROLLED. Right? But then, a little while later, he remembered that — oh yeah, he kinda liked you. So, hey, he’s in control now, right? So he calls you, you get together. What’s the problem?
Well, he of course wasn’t in control. He’s still reeling. So when you confronted him, he told you what he thinks is going on. No emotions. Hadn’t been any since that last girl.
VERDICT: THE SEA WAS ANGRY THAT DAY…
I think there’s just too much damn emotional turbulence for this guy right now. He has no way to measure his emotions right now because they’re off the charts. And being a control guy, his “charts” don’t likely allow for too much swing in there in the first place.
I don’t think he meant all that he said. Not exactly. I think he felt a little backed into a corner, like you were prying into his weird, scary…undefinable…(out of control)…emotional state, and he wanted to bite you on the nose to keep you from poking around in there. After all, if he can’t control it, he certainly doesn’t feel very comfortable having it on display. (MANSLATOR’S NOTE: Most men refuse to put their emotions on display because it’s impossible to estimate the dimensions of the display case when you’re at Home Depot. Very frustrating.)
Good luck, Heather, and I’m sorry that you got caught up in the emotional whirlwind. I can’t tell you whether or not he’ll ever be ready for something. But I think you did the right thing. Just because he’s going through what he’s going through is no reason for you to have to batten down YOUR hatches every time he gets nervous. If you even have hatches. (If you do have hatches, you might want to see House M.D. He’ll figure it out.)
What’s the word, ladies? Grief? Lack of Interest? Emotional Turbulence? What’s the deal?
Posted: March 12th, 2008 under Reader Requests.
Comments
Comment from LA Lady
Time March 12, 2008 at 9:53 am
Unfortunately this is an all to common situation. Heather’s experience is very similar to mine with a male friend. His best friend’s wife just passed away and he is exhibiting all of the same behaviors. I have decided to just let it all play out however he wants and to be there when he needs me. (He needed to talk for over an hour the morning after she died).
I think the male nature to “fix things” and their failure to cure the cancer is an especially hard blow. They can’t seem to hear that if the doctors can’t “fix” it neither can they.
Thanks for sharing this post as it gives me more patience with my friend, as he goes through the grieving process.
LA Lady
Comment from Tonya
Time March 12, 2008 at 10:43 am
Whew.. boy do I know this one all too well. When my soldier and I began dating, my father was dying of cancer and my soldier was preparing for deployment to Iraq. Things moved REALLY fast for us because we had known each other since high school and we both felt very emotional with all that we were dealing with.
My soldier did this very same thing about a month before he left for war and right after my dad died. He didn’t say anything hurtful but did tell me that he couldn’t continue to see me because when we were together, he felt “vulnerable and emotional and couldn’t go to war feeling that way.” He also felt helpless (another icky feeling for men) because he wanted to be there to “take care of me and my kids” and he couldn’t because he would be in Iraq for 15 months. He was also very sure that I’d meet someone else while he was away.
It was very confusing and difficult for me back then (Manslator, I wish I knew of you then!). I gave him his space and he would call and tell me that he wasn’t going anywhere. He stated over and over that he wanted to stay in my life but wouldn’t see me at all. It was very frustrating. I chalked it up to pre-deployment nerves and whatever he needed to do to prepare emotionally for war.
So, here it is 6 months later and he’s still calling me from Iraq and we stay in touch over email. He’s very loving and sweet and supportive. He’s talking plans with me for when he returns. I still don’t know what’s going to happen. He’ll be gone for another year still. But I do know that he does care for me and, as Jeff said, didn’t like that “out of control” feeling.
I’d say give him space and see what happens. Don’t depend on him for anything. Take care of yourself. Date someone else if you want to. I certainly don’t think he’s replacing you with someone else. I believe that the connection was there and maybe he’ll come back to it when he’s feeling stable again. If not, then it wasn’t meant to be.
Comment from mar
Time March 12, 2008 at 11:01 am
Goodness.
I haven’t experienced the death of anybody dear to me and I shall not pretend that I have much of an insight into how that feels. Nevertheless, the idea that he might have been in denial and is now emotionally confused does sound like a plausible explanation. Also, the idea that he wants to be in control, and one way to be in control of one’s life is to cut off things: thus, he might have broken up because that’s the only way to “control” that part of his life, that is, not having it. I’m not saying this is what is happening to him, only that it is an explanation that makes sense.
I do not know why he said the things he said when he broke up. It looks to me like they can’t be true, given Heather’s account of their relationship. I can only guess, along with Jeff, that he is not having a good understanding of what’s going on, inside him, emotionally. The name for that is “emotional disconnectedness.” It involves not recognizing and understanding one’s own emotions and also not being able to recognize and understand others’ emotions. To say that he did not feel for Heather was extremely insensitive, and it suggests to me somebody who does not understand emotions (his or others’). All of this may me a consequences of the grieving process.
Best advice to Heather is to accept the current situation, try not to take those words seriously, and try to move on. Also, if she can find it in her heart, she may want to be available if he needs her. But only on the assumption that she is prepared to endure the difficulty involved in supporting someone who may not be emotionally available for a relationship. And that may be very tough.
Myself, I am coming out of a relationship with someone who lost her mother to cancer about a year before he and I started dating, and he’s behaviour and ability to get involved emotionally has been very erratic. I’m not sure how much that has to do with his mother’s death, for I did not know him before, but perhaps a lot more than I had thought.
Best,
Mar
Comment from Heather
Time March 12, 2008 at 11:28 am
Thanks for everyone’s imput. I really appreciate it. This is a GOOD man in every sense of the word even though I try to villify him in my mind sometimes to make it easier to be without him. I knew going in it would be a rocky road but I never expected the chemistry that was there right from the beginning…my guess is he didn’t either.
I tried to be patient and wait but the not knowing made me feel, hmmmm…vulnerable so I sent the email.
I would be there for him in a heartbeat if he needed me because like I said…he is a good man. He called when he said he’d call, he was kind, he was polite (opened doors, got water ready for me before we would go to sleep).
I miss him so much and worry about him but he’s got good friends and his father and brother…I guess those are the people he needs now.
Thanks again…this REALLY did help a lot!!!
Comment from mmagnolia
Time March 12, 2008 at 11:05 pm
Dear Heather, methinks it would be good for you to share with him that you “would be there for him in a heartbeat”–as you wrote here. Send an email, or a handwrit card. Both my parents are deceased, and a brother-in-law [more like a kid brother] died two weeks ago. People mourn differently. Be mindful that you broke with him first; his flippancy was kin to ‘seeing you one, and raising you ten’; both your reactions were self-protective reactions. U2 did meet at a tense time. He may associate your moments–however magical–with the horrors associated wth his Mom’s demise. On the other hand: he may cherish your having been “there” for him during that horror–possibly both feelings at the same time! You owe some form of honor to that relationship [which never dies because history cannot be re-written!]. That honor [given his goodness AND your goodness!] could embody your being the one who reaches out. What harm or foul can there be? There is no guarantee of any result except the first sweet pleasure one human being can give another which is acknowledgement of the other’s reality. A sweet part of the reality U2 seem to have shared is “goodness”. Besides all that: it’s Springish, Dear Heather–so hop to it 4both of you & cherish!
Comment from autumnmoon
Time March 17, 2008 at 6:38 pm
Grief is a natural part of life………the way you react to his grief, sets the stage for how he will hopeful treat you when you are going through it.
A gentle touch and your presence is often the best response, followed by a whispered, How can I help?
Pingback from The Case of the Returned Necklace – or Grief Part Deux « Manslations
Time April 30, 2008 at 6:32 am
[...] 30, 2008 We’ve got a follow-up on a post from a while back entitled, “Was that Just His Grief Talking?” A reader named Heather is trying to figure out, once and for all, Is he IN or is he OUT? [...]
Comment from Cassidy
Time March 12, 2008 at 8:36 am
Kudos to you for standing by him during what is quite possibly the most suckiest time ever.
Having just lost a relative to terminal cancer, everything that you outlined is EXACTLY to a T, how many members of my immediate family handled the situation. The men were all catty-whompous and the women were just beat down.
Basically, I’m saying we were all there during his last two weeks of life, day in, day out…..and cancer deaths are quite possibly the most horrible way to die. It’s absolutely heart wrenching to watch someone hurt that much.
During those days we each went through our denial, from my mother trying to save him by feeding him ice cream to myself, 4 hours before he died, saying God performs miracles and he would live and be okay.
Of course we were all putting ourselves through as much torture as he was going through, but it helped us deal with the situation.
Now, me being a female (thank goodness- I think it would be hard to be a guy) I am still reeling over his death, day in and day out. I relieve some moments. It’s been 8 months and it’s still very raw and fresh as I am sure it is for your guy friend.
Even though it did not work out (and I’m truly sorry that it didn’t) you were there during such a crucial time and I bet dollars to donuts he’s very appreciative of that….
Not much help but I have to say, I think the guy is just grief stricken. It was his mommy!!! Doesn’t matter how old you get your mom will always be your mommy.